tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post8738979844493974752..comments2023-11-05T06:16:56.961-05:00Comments on the Carpentry Way: This One Rings a Bell (8)Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14328401081765407624noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post-73198647893159495352015-09-29T22:17:49.162-04:002015-09-29T22:17:49.162-04:00Sag in the body of the roof is usually a percentag...Sag in the body of the roof is usually a percentage of the length over which the roof is curved. A given length might be 'L', which the sag will be 4/100 of 'L' typically. The deepest point of the sag might be in the middle of the length, or it might be at some other point, depending upon how the length might be divided up into parts. There are various methods for determining the tarumi, however those books you obtained are pattern books so they don't show such techniques. Those books are about the proportions between parts and the slopes of the roofs, arrangements of structural members for aesthetics, etc. You're expected to already have a grasp on such things by the time you come to look at pattern books. The first picture of this post does give you some clues however....<br /><br />~CAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14328401081765407624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post-69688535026479160992015-09-28T15:47:27.811-04:002015-09-28T15:47:27.811-04:00Chris,
I have taken your recommendations and have...Chris,<br /><br />I have taken your recommendations and have bought my own copy of Mr. Togashi's gate pattern text. I liked it so much, I got his temple layout book too!<br /><br />One question that I can't seem to fit the puzzle together to is the 弛み (tarumi). In the layout text, he appends a fraction (such as 3/10 etc) to the concave curve (assuming we are working with a concave profile roof). However, explicit steps into how to "use" that number to generate a concave curve is still shrouded in mystery. I believe the method illustrated in the first picture of this post describes the method I'm trying to seek. Any light shed to this issue will be much appreciated, thanks.<br /><br />Keep up the good work,<br />FrankAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post-64604661495003532802014-11-25T19:30:39.627-05:002014-11-25T19:30:39.627-05:00Michael,
what you end up with when the hip is pla...Michael,<br /><br />what you end up with when the hip is placed at an irregular angle is that the roof surface in front of the gable is at a slacker pitch than the main roof surface. I can't speak so well to the tile issue, a this is outside my area of expertise.<br /><br />~CAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14328401081765407624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post-46809000079041540432014-11-25T19:21:19.756-05:002014-11-25T19:21:19.756-05:00Yes, all of those curves and roof members should c...Yes, all of those curves and roof members should come into play to determine that angle. However, I am baffled even more by the "slope" of the roof so to speak on each side of the roof. By quick intuition, I suppose that the slope on the front side (usually the long side on a rectilinear building) will have a much steeper slope than the short side caused by the irregular hip? And with that, how do a tiled roof cope with this in relation with tile laying? Wouldn't the pendant tile on the long and short side have differing angles? This is all so interesting as irregular roofs aren't really dominant around my area.<br /><br />Thanks once again, MichaelAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post-85610349139567771992014-11-25T19:05:35.096-05:002014-11-25T19:05:35.096-05:00Michael,
are you referring to the plan angle of t...Michael,<br /><br />are you referring to the plan angle of the hip?<br /><br />The irregular hip angle is not determined simply by whim, but in interrelation to the proportions of the gable to the roof, whether the gable is convex or concave down the roof slope, etc. so, yes, the angle of the irregular hip, both in plan and in elevation is a very important design consideration.<br /><br />~CAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14328401081765407624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post-21432943346688460082014-11-25T18:29:28.447-05:002014-11-25T18:29:28.447-05:00Thank you Chris. Does it matter to the Japanese c...Thank you Chris. Does it matter to the Japanese carpenter, the angles used on the irregular hip? Assuming that a traditional regular hip gable has a ridge angled on 45 degrees?<br /><br />MichaelAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post-4532220813361707532014-11-25T17:49:48.211-05:002014-11-25T17:49:48.211-05:00Michael,
glad to have piqued your curiosity.
Th...Michael,<br /><br />glad to have piqued your curiosity. <br /><br />The irregular hip version is, on larger and more expensive structures, rather more the norm than the type with regular hips. <br /><br />An irimoya roof is called an irimoya roof regardless of whether the hips are regular or irregular. The term for irregular hipped roof construction however is fure-zumi yane. <br /><br />~CAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14328401081765407624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post-35802081945634895412014-11-25T15:56:55.653-05:002014-11-25T15:56:55.653-05:00Hi Chris,
You have peeked my curiosity here on a ...Hi Chris,<br /><br />You have peeked my curiosity here on a matter: irregular hip gables.<br /><br />Do you know how prevalent the Japanese use irregular hip gables over the regular hip gables on larger structures such as Sanmon? For example, some really large gates, such as Chion-in's Sanmon, seems to have an irregular hip gabled roof (I might be wrong, but it darn looks like it).<br /><br />Lastly, what is the Japanese term for the irregular hip gabled roof? I know that the regulars are called irimoya but can't seem to find anything related to the irregulars. :)<br /><br />Cheers,<br />MichaelAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post-34775557894683828912011-03-17T09:28:44.986-04:002011-03-17T09:28:44.986-04:00I use SketchUp - glad you like it.I use SketchUp - glad you like it.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14328401081765407624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post-31937795087216783572011-03-16T23:06:05.937-04:002011-03-16T23:06:05.937-04:00Hi there, i just came across this site because im ...Hi there, i just came across this site because im searchinglike this, anyway what program are you using? thanks...<br />i like the way you did it.. its a work of art!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post-5655443837803530012010-09-12T14:30:17.736-04:002010-09-12T14:30:17.736-04:00Tom,
sorry for the late reply. I think that your ...Tom,<br /><br />sorry for the late reply. I think that your idea is a good one and that with a concave roof surface, getting the sheets to lay flat might well be a hassle. It wasn't a problem with a convex roof surface, but I can see why it would be with a concave one. So, I'll look to use boards there.<br /><br />Dale, glad you are enjoying the thread so far and thanks for the compliments on how it's looking at this point. Changes are afoot however...<br /><br />~ChrisAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14328401081765407624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6261993076995357307.post-36695555181542554542010-09-01T09:23:04.449-04:002010-09-01T09:23:04.449-04:00Chris,
its just gorgeous! You are a brave man to...Chris,<br /><br />its just gorgeous! You are a brave man to walk into a situation with a curved irregular hip. Most would run from it. But... Is plywood a good choice for a doubly curved roof? I would be afraid of getting a 'bubble' in the center of a sheet and not being able to nail it down properly. I had a singly curved roof long ago and talked the architect out of ply and into boards which worked splendidly. Anyway, its gorgeous.<br /><br />Tomtomausmichigannoreply@blogger.com